General opinions on the USA

[bountyhunter]

I was just thinking about this, so I want to know what your guys genral opinions on this country are right now.

[andre]

I am glad I live here at least, for the most part. I mean, the entire PATRIOT Act and the phony war on terrorism and whatnot are not very good for the US. But I do enjoy the constitutional protections, especially the First Amendment. The whole gay marriage thing is really wack though. Overall, I would say 70/30, but leaning toward 60/40. I would move from this country if I were old enough and had enough money. I don't hate this country, but it's getting crazy.

[Wh|tE gUy]

No place greater to live. The only reason we come off so bad is because we are held to such a higher standard than every other nation. We are expected to have higher morals and act more civil than every single other nation in the world.

Basically we are great for 2 main reasons. Capitolism gives motivation to our people and our principles let us say what we want and question anything, leading to progressive change. If you're not the outspoken, ambitious type then maybe America aint the place for you, but for those who are this place is a ******* haven and dont you forget it.

[Rensa]

Hm... despite the numerous derogitory jokes I've made about Americans before (all in good fun... because you've made kanagaroo jokes before... right? >_<), I'd say most Americans are pretty cool (unfortunately, I don't think the current President is one of them ^^).

In fact, I would go as far as to say that my time with GCA has dramatically changed my opinion of America - as a result of being with GCA, I now know lots of cool Americans, which rocks. :D

I respect the fact that America has become the dominant power in the world over the last century by promoting the values it holds dear. Probably my only quip with America is that sometimes its status makes it a little self-centered: it feels disheartening when things happen like the Bali bombings and it's largely ignored.

I don't mean to start a flame war over this, and I certainly don't want to sound racist. I know there are things that suck about Australia too, ang I don't mind hearing them at all, so long as they're founded (hell, I'll probably agree with them!). America's pretty cool all round - just get rid of the twit on top, okay? ;)

[Shoxx]

I think it's a great place to live. I'm not so sure on the terrorism war, it all seems fake to me, but, other than that, it's a great place to live.

[Messiah]

You's are still cocky though












































:D

[Master Yoda]

Yes we are the cockiest nation in the world that is due to capitalism and because we are just that damn good. As for our President he is doing a fine job, not the best but he is doing a better job than John Kerry would. And the war on terror is a war this country needs to be in right now. Would you like this country to get attacked again or would you like our ally countries to get attacked? People attack us because they are envious of what we have and that is freedom and money.

[bountyhunter]

Which people are those? The arabs atack us because we support Israel, not because they hate capatalism or are jealous of our money.

Originally posted by andre
I am glad I live here at least, for the most part. I mean, the entire PATRIOT Act and the phony war on terrorism and whatnot are not very good for the US. But I do enjoy the constitutional protections, especially the First Amendment. The whole gay marriage thing is really wack though. Overall, I would say 70/30, but leaning toward 60/40. I would move from this country if I were old enough and had enough money. I don't hate this country, but it's getting crazy.


yeh, I feel the same way. I like the capitalism but this country has become internally ****ed up. A ****load of people are just plain ******* dumb, no other way to put it, unless of course they only act dumb to make me think they're dumb....

I'm not exactly sure what terrorism is, and never have been. I through a waterbottle at my brother and scard him, so I assume I'm a terrorist by word because I terrorized him. Plus, the Iraqi's that are atacking our troups over in Iraq are also terrorists, but they're realy only fighting a foreign invader. Put it this way: I come to your house decked out in various destructive weaons; grenades hangning from strings on my knees, handguns strapped to my knees, an AK hanging on my back, and some sort of explosive projectile in my hands. I invade your home, destroying it and killing your family on the excuse that your father beat your mother when he was drunk, something that was becoming more and more frequent. Then say you blow my leg off with a shotgun you obtained through some happening or another. Now I call you a terrorist. But who's realy the terrorist?

And speaking about the gay marriage thing...All I have to say is that it just completely discusts me.

Now don't get me wrong, I to love living here, and no it's easier then living anywhere else in the world(except possibly japan), but things have become so ****ed up this country has started to discust me. This country is still relatively in it's childhood, but it seems it is already going down the line of drugs and whores.

Speaking of them ho's, what's up? This country is full of *****es and freaks.

[MAX]

I love America...

[andre]

dude, bountyhunter, you rock man. i loved that piece up there.

by the way, the only reason America became a superpower is due to unambigious nationalism spawned by fear and hatred, along with bullying the Spanish for "sinking" the USS Maine, which was accidently sunk. the entire reason for the greatness is ignorance, prejudice and hatred.

[bountyhunter]

I know what you mean. The thing is, I see someone destroying this place soon. It's obvious that there's no way in hell America can survive an internal atack. Not spies, not weeds, nothing would be able to stop a well thought atack that was conceived and caried out inside this country. With all our troups gone fighting their ****ed up crusades, how the hell are a bunch of overweight women going to stop a massive atack against "freedom." Your dead on about the ignorance. YOu can tell just by watching the news that most of the people here have no idea what they're talking about. All they know is lets go shoot some a-rAbs because they're evil and they hate freedom, capatalism, and our way of life. The sad thing is, this country has a great foundation: capatlism, as said before, is the way to go. But the whole freedom of freedom idea and the lets do it because I can thing has gotten out of hand. Everybody's lying around haveing sex with the opposit sex, the same sex, or the sex that they used to be. The only way to totally change this would be to essentially "reformat" then entire way of living and learning, and by that I mean cut out the whole ideal of freedom of anything, which obviously isn't going to happen side through an apocoliptic war.

I'm glad I've finally found someone that agrees with me:D

[Wh|tE gUy]

Originally posted by andre
dude, bountyhunter, you rock man. i loved that piece up there.

by the way, the only reason America became a superpower is due to unambigious nationalism spawned by fear and hatred, along with bullying the Spanish for "sinking" the USS Maine, which was accidently sunk. the entire reason for the greatness is ignorance, prejudice and hatred.
LOL how bout you open a book once in a while. The Spanish war came 20 years before we established ourselves as a world power, 50 before we became a super power. Since when does defeating Spain mean you are a superpower?

And incase you didnt know BH (which is quite obvious that you don't) we actually still have soldiers not in Iraq believe it or not :eek:

Oh ya, American Intelligence is probably the greatest in the world, it ain't all that easy to get in a sneak attack, ESPECIALLY after 9-11

[Briton-AMN]

America has certainly upped its security. It took me 4 times going throught the metal detector, and on the 4th i was strip searched. JK!

[Wh|tE gUy]

basically any arguement in here that regards any war other than the current only proves my point that the only thing that makes America look bad is that we are held to such a higher standard than everyone else.

PS we only hate the arabs you curse us, burn our flag, and wish for us to burn in hell. I really don't give a crap about arabs or muslims (or anyone for that matter) unless they pose a threat to me and wish me dead.

[Messiah]

"America is great, Australia is better"- A famous quote i dug up

[MoN]

Originally posted by bountyhunter
I come to your house decked out in various destructive weaons; grenades hangning from strings on my knees, handguns strapped to my knees, an AK hanging on my back, and some sort of explosive projectile in my hands. I invade your home, destroying it and killing your family on the excuse that your father beat your mother when he was drunk, something that was becoming more and more frequent. Then say you blow my leg off with a shotgun you obtained through some happening or another. Now I call you a terrorist. But who's realy the terrorist?Sounds like you're describing what Saddam used to do. Good job.

[bountyhunter]

Originally posted by Wh|tE gUy
LOL how bout you open a book once in a while. The Spanish war came 20 years before we established ourselves as a world power, 50 before we became a super power. Since when does defeating Spain mean you are a superpower?

And incase you didnt know BH (which is quite obvious that you don't) we actually still have soldiers not in Iraq believe it or not :eek:

Oh ya, American Intelligence is probably the greatest in the world, it ain't all that easy to get in a sneak attack, ESPECIALLY after 9-11

Of course I know that we still have soldiers not in Iraq. But do you think that if we decided to go after the entire middle east that we'de have any troups left anywher other then there?

Plus, intelligence isn't realy intelligence, cause anyone can stick a statelite anywhere if they have enough money. Wasn't the spanish war after WWII(I'm not sure, but I dunno) when we fought them for cuba? If I'm correct we would have already been a superpower.

There are other atacks then a sneak atack, there are atacks that can't be percieved or defended against at all. lets say "ghost atacks"

Originally posted by MoN
Sounds like you're describing what Saddam used to do. Good job.

Ya think?

[andre]

Originally posted by Wh|tE gUy
LOL how bout you open a book once in a while. The Spanish war came 20 years before we established ourselves as a world power, 50 before we became a super power. Since when does defeating Spain mean you are a superpower?

And incase you didnt know BH (which is quite obvious that you don't) we actually still have soldiers not in Iraq believe it or not :eek:

Oh ya, American Intelligence is probably the greatest in the world, it ain't all that easy to get in a sneak attack, ESPECIALLY after 9-11

I open plenty of books. The US became a superpower due to the colonial possessions gained from the Spanish...Phillipines, Cuba, amongst others. Guam too perhaps, can't particuarly remember. but the point remains that this country very likely will fall apart, no matter how good it is. Lemme think....Babylon, Persia, Greece, Rome....yep. I think America is about due. The world cannot stand an empire for more than a few hundred years, and America has only accelerated its own demise.

[Wh|tE gUy]

just to clear up a few things:

Spanish War was in like 1880 or 1890, somewhere in that time frame. Also, the term superpower refers to nations with nuclear capabilities. USSR and USA were considered the only 2 superpowers after WW2

And we have only been the most dominant force in the world since WW2 ended and Britain officially acknowledged that USA would be taking over england's international role (i believe the exact phrase was "world police")

50 years at top, is time really due? Who would we fall to? We cannot fall without giving our power up to someone. England is not ambitious enough for that title IMO, most european countries that used to hold great influence are losing global significance daily (ie France, Spain), and the UN is too messed up and unorganized. Face it, we have no competition and the only people aimed at bringing us down is a few poor desert dwellers upset with our way of life and our support of Israel.

There will always be a dominant force in the world, it would be impossible for us to let up our dominance without someone else stepping up. At this point, there is no one ready to take the position

[Matt]

The United States stands for Democracy and freedom. It is the duty of the United States to look out for the world.

[Wh|tE gUy]

many would disagree with you, a lot of people do not want to be responsible for the world

[Matt]

The United States is a part of this planet and is therefore responsible for its well being. Also, as humans, it is a responsibility to humanity.

[bountyhunter]

Originally posted by Wh|tE gUy
just to clear up a few things:

Spanish War was in like 1880 or 1890, somewhere in that time frame. Also, the term superpower refers to nations with nuclear capabilities. USSR and USA were considered the only 2 superpowers after WW2

And we have only been the most dominant force in the world since WW2 ended and Britain officially acknowledged that USA would be taking over england's international role (i believe the exact phrase was "world police")

50 years at top, is time really due? Who would we fall to? We cannot fall without giving our power up to someone. England is not ambitious enough for that title IMO, most european countries that used to hold great influence are losing global significance daily (ie France, Spain), and the UN is too messed up and unorganized. Face it, we have no competition and the only people aimed at bringing us down is a few poor desert dwellers upset with our way of life and our support of Israel.

There will always be a dominant force in the world, it would be impossible for us to let up our dominance without someone else stepping up. At this point, there is no one ready to take the position

ahem, a few dessert dwellers that could destroy whatever the **** they wanted to if they all got together at the same time. Plus, there are just plain hateful people that someone can manipulate into destroying things. it's not something taht we can forsee that will bring us down, it will be something new, different.

Matt, stop pulling crap out of your ***. I don't need president bushe's speaches simplified for me. a lot of the world would be better if we left it alone(provided everybody else left it alone, too) yeh, we give relief and crap to poor countries, but giving money and food to people with aids isn't what I'd call productive in anyway. Just keeps them alive long enough so they can have more infected babies.

There have been nations far greater then us in the past toppled by things far less threatening by the enemies we have.

Just wait till we arabs get some nukes. then someone will have hell to pay lolololol

[Wh|tE gUy]

Originally posted by bountyhunter
ahem, a few dessert dwellers that could destroy whatever the **** they wanted to if they all got together at the same time.
By that comment, it seems like you are trying to say the entire middle east wants us dead. But aren't you the one who accuses America of wanting to kill off all arabs? You are pulling **** out of your *** now and completely contradicting yourself. For some reason you think america wants to kill off all arabs and now you are saying all arabs want to kill off america, if the latter is the case then there is absolutely nothing wrong with the former.

Either way you are wrong. It is impossible to sneak a nuke into our boarders and they dont have anything near the technology needed to launch one over here. The terrorists are not as mighty as you think (is this some sort of arab pride or something?). Bottom line is the terrorists are infact poor and weak. I mean how many terrorists are there really? And most of those are against eachother anyways.

Sorry to burst your bubble, i know how much you look up to people like Al-Queda :rolleyes:




:pwn:

[Messiah]

-Flame War-
Avoid igniting, i repeat, avoid igniting!!

[MoN]

Originally posted by bountyhunter
ahem, a few dessert dwellers that could destroy whatever the **** they wanted to if they all got together at the same time.

Just wait till we arabs get some nukes. then someone will have hell to pay lolololol 1. An atomic bomb (or a few) could destroy them all at once if they "got together at the same time."

2. You would WANT them to get nukes? You must be retarded or something. Even if they did, we'd stop their attacks easily...

We should make some satellite-attacking system...ya, GoldenEye or some other James Bond-like "taking over the world" weapon.

[MAX]

If you don't like the U.S. (BH), get the fvck out.

[Immortal-JyNxX]

rott says he loves this country but only sees the fault in this nations actions. I don't see his logic? Just a month ago I was telling him if he don't like it "get the fvck out."

As I'm pretty sure I'm the biggest Patriot here, I gotta say I love the US. Not a place I'll rather be. But I've been very dissapointed in one main thing lately and thats the 9/11 commission. You mean to tell me I should blame the deaths of my aunties on the Brave firefighters and police that was running inside the crumbling towers to save as many as possible. Some risking some giving their lives to save others. But some errors in communication and we shift blame from terroist to hero's. I went to one of the meetings with my mom and I'll never go again. I had bloodlust for this woman who's son died. She had the nerve to say the FDNY didn't do their fvcking job right! Man I flipped I had to leave early, if not I would be in jail.

~ditto~

[bountyhunter]

yeh dude, fat *****es blaming people for stuff that tried to help them. That's the way this country works though. bunch of retarded *** rednecks not knowing what the **** is going on. I will leave soon.

[MAX]

Originally posted by Immortal-JyNxX
rott says he loves this country but only sees the fault in this nations actions. I don't see his logic? Just a month ago I was telling him if he don't like it "get the fvck out."


What are you talking about. You don't have any clue or basis to be making those assumptions. I don't believe I've ever been critical about the US. Maybe I have been about politicians and certain actions I don't think were handled correctly, but I've never went on some tirade about the faults of the US. Sorry to burst your bubble. I'm glad you are the most patriotic one here, maybe you should enlist =) Please?

[Wh|tE gUy]

I too am a little upset with the 9/11 commisions going after fire fighters and other people that helped out. It sickens me really. They did what they could as soon as they could do it. I say internally the PD and FD should question themselves on how well they responded and work on ways to be more efficient if something like this ever happens again, god forbid

[bountyhunter]

yep, it's sad that people are willing to turn against the easiest thing they can, no matter what they did for them.

[andre]

yeah damn that was getting heated. but frankly, when I analyze it, I don't hate this country, I don't love it. Patriotism and Nationalism are the causes of all of the wars that have ever practically existed. and white guy, don't give me history lectures, i know quite a bit about history, btw.

[Rensa]

Originally posted by Messiah
"America is great, Australia is better"- A famous quote i dug up

Cheers to that ;)

Don't worry American members, we're just having a dig at you :D

[Messiah]

No....i was being serious ;)

Anyway, whats everyone think about the torture of I Iraqi's by the American soldiers? Man when all those photo's started pouring in i was overwealmed and quite shocked. It made me so mad, if anyone of the ****s were infront of me now i wouldn't hesitate beating my fists into thier face:mad:. I mean what they did is so goddamn wrong. There's nothing tough about doing those things to someone who cant fight back, ****en pussies!! Those arrogant looks on thier faces, you can tell they think they're so friggen good, like thier more important, if i could only get my hands on them....!!. *tries to calm down* Here's just some of the things that they have done

Breaking chemical lights and pouring the phosphoric liquid on detainees; pouring cold water on naked detainees; beating detainees with a broom handle and a chair; threatening male detainees with rape; allowing a military police guard to stitch the wound of a detainee who was injured after being slammed against the wall in his cell; sodomizing a detainee with a chemical light and perhaps a broom stick, and using military working dogs to frighten and intimidate detainees with threats of attack, and in one instance actually biting a detainee; electrocution of detainees; Stripping of detainees clothing and left in the nude; rape of female detainees; detainees hooded and wires attacted to fingers, toes and penis; male prisoners are positioned to simulate sex with each other; detainees moved to solitary confinement for weeks without sufficent food or living conditions; forced oral sex of male detainees; beatings of detainees by multiple guards......ect, ect.

When i read down that list i just think to myself "how the **** could you do that to another human being" purposely inflict so much pain on another person, its just so friggen malicious and depraved, makes me sick to be part of the same race. I hope they throw the book at these sick ****s!! I know this dosent directly reflect the US but all these stories surfacing lately have really tainted the image of the US, in Australia at least, i cant speak for other countries though.

[bountyhunter]

I'm pretty sure people have the same feeling generally everywhere, 'cept hickville USA. I was watching the news and the reporter went to a bar up in some state north from me, and the reporter asked the people what they though about those things that happened. The majority of the people said something about it being ok, some woman said that they were jsut trying to make us look like the evil ones("they as in the Iraqis, not the criminals). Anyways, only one guy said it made him ashamed to be an American. Anyways, I guess the reason why Wg still stands by this war is that they don't have any white trash in Cali(no pun intended). Oh, and Imus, this guy who has a show on fox news in the morning, said that the soldiers shouldn't be getting court martials, they should be getting medals of honor. what a ******* hick.

Anyways, this basicly justifies them killing our soldiers over there. I'm not saying I'm happy to see people die, because there are few people I would ever truly like to witness die, but I'm sick that they are killing the people fighting against our occupation "terrorists" and "insurgents" The United States is the only true world terrorist, the real Axis of Evil

[Wh|tE gUy]

i would comment on what you said about me but im not sure if it was an insult or not... :confused: BTW we do have some hicks in California, they are mainly in the north or near Death Valley

However, the only good thing so far is that all of theses pictures involve the exact same soldiers. Keep that in mind, this isn't a wide spread thing, it's in a single location (as far as we know). I believe these people should receive SEVERE punishment, at 10 years to any sentence they normally would have received just for ******* with our image.

It is interesting tho, 30 years ago Stanford did a study where they made 10 average students prison guards and 10 prisoners. After a couple of days the "guards" started beating the inmates and by day six they were making them strip naked and simulate sexual activities. Sound familiar? By the way, the 2 week experiment was cut short after 6 days.

PS You are a heartless moron. Al Queda is killing our troops, but thats ok because 8 troops were deuches. And yes we really are terrorists, especially when it comes to the Middle East. Remember when we aided Afghanistan against invading Russian forces? Or how about when Iran was attacking Iraq and we offered help? And lets not forget stepping in when Sadam gassed thousands of Kurds. Yes, we truly are the worst thing in the Middle East


It's people like you that make Muslim's look bad. If you were Christian there is little doubt in my mind that you would be part of the KKK. There is no difference between "The only good American soldier is a dead one" and "The only good arab is a dead arab"

Get the hell out of my country if it that horrible. Oh, wait, you will never have the balls to do that. In that case, STFU

[Matt]

No one is STFU-ing.

[andre]

huh? STFU? me confused. but yeah, this country absolutely deserves the bad rep it is getting. I really don't like it when people say "if you don't like it then get the hell out" and other crap like that. Sounds ignorant as hell. Hey fellas, remember the first post I made in this thread, about the reason I like living here? THE FIRST AMENDMENT. 'Nuff said.


oh yeah, and there is ABSOLUTELY no justification for ANY mistreatment of prisoners AT ALL. If you can justify it, then you are just as bad, if not worse, than the people who are there. Which is probably the case, since most people who were abused were in prison for minor charges, and absolutely not related to terrorism. Some people are just plain *** holes. :mad:

[MoN]

Originally posted by Matt
No one is STFU-ing. You should STFU. Really. If I say it, then it MUST be true (that you need to STFU).

Oh, and basically, if you do NOT like America or its government and constantly complain, you really should just move out of the country if it's an option. I mean, if you think it's only the Bush administration and once he is out of office the country will all of the sudden change so much (it won't...), then I guess you should stay, BUT when you're acting like bountyhunter, you don't need to stay in this country. Bountyhunter sounds like he's a terrorist sent from the Middleeast...I don't trust him...sounds like he has many terrorist thoughts...

[bountyhunter]

No Wg, I was not insulting you when I made the comment about hicks.

In all truth, once I get old enough I truly do plan on getting the **** out of this place.

I don't think our troups should die because a few of them are ****ed in the head, I just can't bring myself to feel sorow for them if they do die because they aren' t there to save people. I honestly believe many of them think that they are there doing something good, but in truth they are not. The USA wants it's dick in the pants of everyone, and will do anything to get it there. You can call me stupid all you want, but you would be the stupid one for not seeing that.

I will not say Sadam was a good guy, I will not say he's going to heaven, because I honestly believe he will, at least for a long time, suffer in hell for what he has done. But we are not god, and it is not our duty to right every wrong that is occuring. But then again, that of course is only what we say we are doing.

Does your dumbass know why we helped the Afghans fight off the Russians? Because Russia was our enemy. We were only doing what was in our best interests. Same with a lot of those weapons Sadam has.......we gave them to him.

If I am a heartless bastard, which may be acurate in the very slightest account, then maybe it helps me see what's truly going on. I'm not fed **** by my parents or anyone else, I examine things for myself and I have long hours at school to think about them and sort through the mess, not stoping and wallowing in my own misery because someone that had no business being where they were died.

And why the ******* hell would I be in the kkk? Because I'm not overwhelmed with grief for a bunch of highschool dropouts(degrading as that comment was, you will find it is most likely the overwhelming truth) that died killing my people? I don't hate any race in specific, hell, I don't even hate the general jewish religion because I know there are good people tied up in every knot, caught in every web. Plus, the kkk was specifically a white supremisist group, much like the nazis. They'd kill me before they let me join(provided they were still around in power).

[MoN]

If you examine things for yourself, then have you lived in Iraq? Can you actually COMPARE what it was like when Saddam was in power to how it is while America is there? Answer that, k?

Oh, and Wg made an analogy, I believe. He never once said you were in the KKK or that you even wanted to join them...

[bountyhunter]

True, he said if I was christian I would be in the kkk, but it wasn't even an acurate analogy.

[MoN]

Nah, that's not his analogy. That was more of his opinion/way of being a smart ***. The analogy was:
Originally posted by Wh|tE gUy
There is no difference between "The only good American soldier is a dead one" and "The only good arab is a dead arab"

[Rensa]

Looks like two wrongs make a right. -_- American troops being mis-treated doesn't justify them beating Iraqi detainees.

And guys, chill. Stop picking out insults where there are none, or if there are, stop putting them in. We don't need it ^^

[Wh|tE gUy]

ok here is the good we have done that i can name off the top of my head (who cares the motives!)

-Helped Afghanistan against USSR
-Helped Iraq vs Iran
-Helped Kurdistan vs Iraq
-Removed the Taliban

How many negative things can you specifically name that we have done there? Go ahead and mention the Iraq War, but removing Sadam from that region was a blessing to most, if not all, his neighbors

[bountyhunter]

k

1. We moved the palestinians out of their own country

2. We don't let the UN touch Israel on anything

3. Our wars are killing a lot of bystanders, wether we are helping them or not

4. We are making stupid aligations that make people over there look bad("axis of evil" anyone?)

5. We've made the area hostile by our border placements

6. We had some bans on Iraq or something that said it would be illegal or something like that for anycountry to buy oil from Iraq, give Iraq food, trade with Iraq, and so on that realy hurt their economy, all because we wanted one man out of power.

Plus, these events lead to atacks against us, such as the US embassy bombings and 9/11

[MoN]

Go back to the Middle East, specifically Iraq. Please.

[jamesc359]

Originally posted by bountyhunter
k

1. We moved the palestinians out of their own country

2. We don't let the UN touch Israel on anything

3. Our wars are killing a lot of bystanders, wether we are helping them or not

4. We are making stupid aligations that make people over there look bad("axis of evil" anyone?)

5. We've made the area hostile by our border placements

6. We had some bans on Iraq or something that said it would be illegal or something like that for anycountry to buy oil from Iraq, give Iraq food, trade with Iraq, and so on that realy hurt their economy, all because we wanted one man out of power.

Plus, these events lead to atacks against us, such as the US embassy bombings and 9/11Just so you know, the second this tread gets hot, I'm out of here.

Anyways;
1. How so? I thought it was the U.N. http://news.bbc.co.uk/cbbcnews/hi/find_out/guides/world/middle_east/newsid_1909000/1909217.stm

2. Why should we? The U.N. doesn't bother to mess with the Palestinian terrorists. Say what you will, but we all know they won't stop untill Israel has been drove into the sea.

3. Indeed. Thats why war should be avoided at all costs. Of course sometimes it isn't avoidable. Afghanistan wasn't really avoidable. Iraq was though.

4. How is calling China, Afghanistan, Iraq, etc. etc. a member of the "Axis of Evil" make them and their human rights violations look any worse?

5. Yes it makes them more hostile to us... But the fact remains that the entire area would be hostile regardless of our meddleing.

6. You don't even have a clue as to what you're talking about. We had no such ban. It was the U.N. as a whole. Also it wasn't as dramatic as you state. Iraq was free to sell their oil and buy as much food/meds and the like as they needed. Things that could however have a military use were of course banned.

Also what you normaly don't hear/read about is that Sadam had plenty of food sitting on the docks that, well just sat there untill he traded it off for something of his benefit.

[Wh|tE gUy]

Originally posted by bountyhunter
k

1. We moved the palestinians out of their own country

2. We don't let the UN touch Israel on anything

3. Our wars are killing a lot of bystanders, wether we are helping them or not

4. We are making stupid aligations that make people over there look bad("axis of evil" anyone?)

5. We've made the area hostile by our border placements

6. We had some bans on Iraq or something that said it would be illegal or something like that for anycountry to buy oil from Iraq, give Iraq food, trade with Iraq, and so on that realy hurt their economy, all because we wanted one man out of power.

Plus, these events lead to atacks against us, such as the US embassy bombings and 9/11
See? I gave EXACT instances and you can barely muster up vague inaccuracies. And as the person above me said, most of those things were done by the UN.

Did ANY of the things you mention outweigh the good done by protecting Kurdistan? How about removing the taliban? The answer is no. It's easy to notice all the bad that is done, that doesn't mean you can't keep your eyes open for the good.

[Messiah]

All i can say is the USA's image at the present time aint the best its been.

Oh, i watched the Bowling for Columbine the other day, a good doco, and made me realise what ****ed up gun laws you have over there "Every man has the right to own a gun?" how mindless is that? And that figure about the number of gun related deaths copared to other countries.....i think ours was about 59 deaths a year and Britains 40 something, but America's is like 11,000..thats wacked!! Thats one issue that really needs addressing. :(

[MoN]

Mainly because we're located next to Mexico. That place is a drughouse and drugs are easily smugged across the border.

[bountyhunter]

I thought we got most of our drugs from columbia........

And, if it means anything, we've completely destroyed Iraq. Yeh, we plan on rebuilding it, but that will take another decade at the minimum. The best thing we can do for them now is to pull out completely and let them decide who their own goveernment will be, not us apointing people who we want to be their leaders.

I know we've done a few good things there, but we've also done a lot of things that aren't welcome. If we realy wanted to help for the purpose of being good, we wouldn't be making borders and threateing countries with destruction, we would offer support such as ideas and stuff, like comercial plans and sort. We're not only destroying a bunch of countries(in the most literal ways) but we're destroying ourselves. We don't have enough money to rebuild the entire area.

[jamesc359]

Messiah, not every man has the right to own a gun in the US. For example; If you've been convicted of a felony, you don't have a right to own a gun. Anways, you should read Truth about Bowling for Columbine (http://www.hardylaw.net/Truth_About_Bowling.html) before you take anything in that so called "documentary" serious.

bountyhunter, while most of the drugs in the US do come from Columbia they get here by coming through Mexico. They're called "Mules". People (Usually Mexicans) that want to come to the US. They of course need money to get and live here. So the major drug dealers (who only give a crap if the balloon/condom busts in there stomach and kills them only because it means the loss of their drugs.) use them.

Strangly enough, I agree that we should have left Iraq alone. Infact we should have told the UN that we're pulling out. No more patrolling the Iraqi borders and getting shot at, only to have the whole freaking world jump down our throats for firing back.

I know a lot of people will not like this. But the world needs us to be their police man. Kosovo is the perfect example. By the time the UN got around to getting off their lazy asses there wouldn't have been any thing left to do. Milosevic would have had them all killed by then. And even assuming they did get off their asses before then, guess who would have still done all the heavy lifting? The primary members of NATO. The US, England and Canada.

The same thing happened with Iraq. We (US, England, Canada, Germany, etc. etc.) did all the real work. Everybody else just threw in a hand full of troops to make it look good.

I guess just like all policemen most people hate us... Right up untill they need us. Then we're their best friends.

[Wh|tE gUy]

Originally posted by bountyhunter
I thought we got most of our drugs from columbia........

And, if it means anything, we've completely destroyed Iraq. Yeh, we plan on rebuilding it, but that will take another decade at the minimum. The best thing we can do for them now is to pull out completely and let them decide who their own goveernment will be, not us apointing people who we want to be their leaders.


If we were to pull out tho, Iraq would not be able to "choose" their new leader. Some militant such as Al Sadr would seize power then they would be back to where they were 5 years ago. And it will take much less than a decade to rebuild Iraq, atleast to the point it was prior to the war. I say it will take 5 years to rebuild it to better condition than it was with Sadam there. We are already focusing on the schools and making sure the buildings are safe, have windows, etc.

Completely destroyed is an extreme exaggeration. Look at film of Europe 1945 and you will see "completely destroyed," check out Nagasaki or Hiroshima September 1945, THATS "completely destroyed"

[bountyhunter]

true, but it was meant ot be an exageration. Anyway, it's going to take more then 5 years to rebuild, trust me. It might be a gamble if we pulled out now, but you can't be sure what would happen because something like that over there has never realy happened.

And messiah, I think james pwnd you with that comment about the UN's "primary members" lol

The sad thing is, we're trying to make every country out there just like us. Just look at europe. After we rebuilt it and all after WWII it's like our little brother, as in it's very smiliar to us. Japan? After we destroyed it it's basicly the same as us too. They are capatalists, right?

Regarudless of what we do, we can't afford to continue to poor money into every corner of the world.

[Wh|tE gUy]

Yes look how horrible Japan has turned out... oh wait it is an economic power house and a beacon of light in asia. But Germany... oh wait Germany is just as successful (socialist btw). The more countries are like us the better off they do. Accept it, it's a fact.

And the reason we pushed for those nations to be just like us after WW2 because we didn't want any more communist nations. Absolutely nothing wrong with that.

And just incase you didn't know, last time i heard we are trying to build Iraq into a socialism

[MoN]

Nah, it's not a fact -- many people/nations love living in poverty.....

[Rensa]

I love the way this thread started out as a member looking for the world's opinions on the US, yet has become a thread for US members to justify themselves. This seems to happen an awful lot. Nobody's saying that the US is the bad guy. Those who replied simply tried to lay out (fairly ;)) objectively the pros and cons of the country (because no country is perfect), and the rest of the board has come in to rip holes in those criticisms. The entire point of asking for the world's opinion is to accept it, not tell it that's it wrong. :]

[Wh|tE gUy]

We aren't telling people their opinions are wrong, we are asking them to justify their opinions and then tell them when their logic is inaccurate.

And yes, BH pretty much said USA is the badguy, probably because we do not want to see Israel burn to the ground.

[Messiah]

Originally posted by jamesc359
Messiah, not every man has the right to own a gun in the US. For example; If you've been convicted of a felony, you don't have a right to own a gun. Anways, you should read Truth about Bowling for Columbine (http://www.hardylaw.net/Truth_About_Bowling.html) before you take anything in that so called "documentary" serious.

I thought it would be a foregone conclusion that a convicted felon (depending on the crime) wouldn't be allowed to own a firearm. I spose thats a bad on my part as i should have worded it better:rolleyes: . The figures that they had about the gun realted deaths were what alarmed me the most anyway. Even when you look at the figures on that link you gave the statistic's are still very overwealming. That said, i feel that the current gun laws in your country are very.....how should i say this, stupid. I've had that opinion for a long time, dont think i just jumped on the bandwagon because of BFC doco. We Australian's recently (i'm talking the last few years) had our gun laws changed, and the new rules that were put into effect seem to be having a really positive impact.

By 1997, Australia's States and Territories passed the most significant gun law reforms in their history, including a ban on semi-automatic rifles and pump-action shotguns; registration of all firearms and licensing of all shooters; and safe storage requirements for guns and ammunition.

To persuade gun-owners to turn in their semi-automatic long guns, the Australian government established a buyback program, funded by the Federal Government and administered by the States and Territories. Reimbursements were generous; the program eventually cost over $320 million Australian dollars and resulted in over 643,000 guns being turned in. Per capita, the Australian buyback was massive, equivalent to an estimated 40 million guns in the US.

Has anything changed in Australia since the new laws went into effect? Between 1987 and 1996, 100 Australians were killed in mass killings of four or more people. Since the new laws went into effect, there has not been a single massacre. Moreover, in Australia, homicides committed with firearms have been declining - slowly before the Port Arthur Massacre, more sharply since - from 28 percent of all homicides in 1989-90 to 16 percent in 2001.

Along with the declining use of firearms in homicide, Australia has seen a decline in the use of firearms in armed robberies. From 1993 to 2001, the proportion of robberies committed with a firearm dropped from 16 to 6 percent.

Suicide rates using a firearm show a sharp drop from 1979-98 with rates continuing to drop after 1996 and firearm-related accidental injuries in Australia are also declining. Public health experts see these declines as related to tighter controls over who may obtain a gun, stricter requirements for training and safe storage, and longer waiting periods for obtaining gun licenses.

I just feel if the US adopted a similar scheme to this they would see a considerable improvement in all related area's.;)

[Rensa]

Uh... that's *exactly* what I was going to say ^^

I think that even if Bowling For Columbine is slightly messed up, its basic message is still true - rather, its credibility is a little undermined. That doesn't chnage the fact that America has monsterously higher gun deaths than other countries.

[Messiah]

Got it in one Rensa...

[bountyhunter]

It doesn't matter if convicted felans can't own guns.......it's still easier to get one then **** no matter who you are or what you did.

[Messiah]

Thats what i'm sayin, tougher gun laws

[MoN]

Tougher gun laws? lolololol, gun laws aren't so much the problem, you know. Tons of the deaths are caused by people with illegal guns.......

You can stop having something around. Look at drugs. Isn't that a laugh?

[jamesc359]

That article doesn't state what the requirements for owning/registering a gun are, so its impossible for me to comment on that.
By 1997, Australia's States and Territories passed the most significant gun law reforms in their history, including a ban on semi-automatic rifles and pump-action shotguns; registration of all firearms and licensing of all shooters; and safe storage requirements for guns and ammunition.Banning "semi-automatic rifles" and "pump-action shotguns" would do little to nothing here. Mostly because the weapon of choice in crimes is not either of those two. Here the ideal weapon (for criminals) is a pistol. Usually the cheap and disposable type.

Also banning such weapons would piss off a lot of people here. We have become used to being able to own guns. In fact the vast majority of people that own guns never use them in a crime. Assault Rifles are used for commonly used for hunting deer and elk. And where ever you find bird hunters you're almost certain to find a (pump) shotgun.

I suggest you read this (http://www.hardylaw.net/rates.html) before you think to much of our gun violence.

One last thing, we also have laws on the safe storage of weapons and ammo. In fact we've had them for quite some time.

[andre]

Originally posted by Wh|tE gUy
ok here is the good we have done that i can name off the top of my head (who cares the motives!)

-Helped Afghanistan against USSR
-Helped Iraq vs Iran
-Helped Kurdistan vs Iraq
-Removed the Taliban

How many negative things can you specifically name that we have done there? Go ahead and mention the Iraq War, but removing Sadam from that region was a blessing to most, if not all, his neighbors

well...since we helped out the Afghani's by giving them weapons and such....they used those against our troops over a decade later....and since the Taliban was ousted, tribal warlords now control a good deal of the county, and a new source of anger against the US has spurred up. I named two specific negative things. That's half your glorified list.

[Wh|tE gUy]

Hind sight is 20/20. We are not responsible for what happened after our interventions in those cases because those happenings were the choice of those nations alone. You saying we should have just let Russia have Afghanistan because we should have known what would happen a couple of decades later? According to your logic, we shouldn't have kicked the nazis out because East Germany eventually fell under communist rule.

[bountyhunter]

yeh, but russia wasn't atacking us like the nazis were (yes, there were some close times, but it never happened). What I'm trying to say is that that's a bit of an exageration.

Plus, they would have broken free from Russia anyway, because Russia fells soon after that anyway.

[andre]

ok....but yeah. The Russians were getting their buts kicked by the Afghani's without good old American stupidity. The Russians weren't intimately familiar with the terrain of Afghanistan.

And the US has stuck its nose in plenty of areas where it didn't belong...
Vietnam (don't give me that Domino Theory bull****)
Iran (didn't the US screw up there anyway?)
Nicaragua
Grenada

the world police...with bullet proof vest chipping away. yeah, those were in the past, but when this country does stupid **** like going to Iraq (anybody see Gen. Anthony Zinni on 60 Minutes today?) and abuse people, then I start to be disgusted with this country.

[bountyhunter]

Originally posted by andre


the world police...with bullet proof vest chipping away.

oh man, that's great stuff

Anyway, yeh, WTF was up with Veitnam? I still don't know why we were over there, and I bet none of you can come up with a good reason either. Speaking of nicaragua, all I can say is that we have poored way to much money into South America and it seems like it's doing nothing but hurting us. i think OPEC was ******* us up real bad. Plus, Why the hell aren't we using that oil up in Alaska? I think either we're trying to deplete the supply in the middle east as to make those countries more disposable, or our government thinks we like paying 50 bucks to fill up our empty SUVs(my mom's Sequoia was empty the other day, it cost $49.39 to fill up).

[Wh|tE gUy]

BH, every time we have to stop to explain things to you the convo is interrupted.

The reason we don't go to Alaska for oil is because we would have to drill for 10 years before we struck anything and in the process we would totally **** up the ecosystem there. Also, the places best suited for finding oil are all nature reserves.

Vietnam was part of the domino theory. We didn't want ANY nations to be communist because we thought that communism would start to spread to neighboring countries and could eventually reach USA. We really can't judge the decision to go into Vietnam because that all happened during the red scare which NO ONE here can comprehend. The decision was made at a certain time under specific circumstances which we can not duplicate thus cannot fully understand.

they would have broken free from Russia anyway, because Russia fells soon after that anyway
Yeah, because everyone already knew the wall would fall in 1989. Let's not forget the government employs the greatest psychics in the world :rolleyes:

Our nation makes decisions in the present not the future. Missions are carried out on the basis of what the possible out come may be not what will happen for certain.

[bountyhunter]

would you rather have me asked questions or just make assumptions. I thought you were the one that didn't want me talking about things I wasn't sure occured the way I thought they did.

Oh well, that domino theory is kindof like what we're doing now in the middle east. We're going to war with all the arab countries on the terms of "spreading democracy and freedom." Don't even deny that, becuase we've been threatening syria and Yemen for quite some time now and they seem to be the next ones on the agenda.

[Messiah]

We dont get taught much American History in Australia so this is basically a history lesson for me :D

[MAX]

I completely decided not to read the last 8 posts, because it seems that it was just a bunch of U.S. bashing... which really isn't the point of this thread.

I love America... I love my job, I love my car, I love my friends, I love the night life... and it's all here in America... so I love America by proxi too. I love Europe just as much though... the architecture, the languages, the food. America is home, Europe is 'the cabin by the lake' that you escape to on the weekends.

[bountyhunter]

hmm.......that might get a bit expensive.

[MAX]

True... but I didn't want to go down the "Bash-America-because-my-barbarian-like-muslim-brothers-and-sisters-in-Iraq-are-doing-it" path that this thread was heading. Let's point out the GOOD things about the US... like how we have the worst math scores, but are still the richest nation. How even though Americans are considered less intelligent (in terms of test scores), we still have the best universities that people from other countries are always trying to get into. Let's talk about how we are NOT a barbaric middle east country. America's awesome...take pride. We may have a CRAP administration at the moment, but America itself is still a great country.

[bountyhunter]

Yeh, I like some things, but I must say our education system is messed up. There are a hell of a lot of useless classes that we are required to take, while we only need 2 combined credits of math and science to graduate. If the government had half a brain between all its "members"(for lack of a better term) then it would put more of an emphasis on math and science then it would whatever bull**** they're teaching us in english class(I wouldn't be able to tell you what that would be cause its always some different bull**** that's not interesting enough or important enough to understand).

[Wh|tE gUy]

Here's something that pretty much sums up how people feel about Americans

My teacher was telling us how she and a group of friends were looking for a flat in England to stay for a few months to a year. They find a perfect one, get all the info, and decide to take the offer. They start moving all their stuff in when the building manager comes in and says that they now have to run the agreement by the complex owner. The owner tells them that the monthly rate is actually several hundred dollars more expensive and utilities are no longer included. Why? Because they were American. After the owner left the building manager was shocked and told them that he had never heard of such charges and felt so bad for them he showed them a building across town.

I've also heard stories of the Greeks resenting American Greeks and charging them much more in restraunts and places like that.

It seems like these things happen pretty often, especially in Europe. In contrast, i personally have never heard of a story of American restraunts and hotels taking advantage of tourists.

[Rensa]

What I thought was really cool was when I went to Japan and met a gorup of my host's ALT (alternative language teacher) friends. We went out to a curry place for dinner and just talked about Japanese stuff, Western stuff, etc. It was pretty interesting b/c of the mix (1 other Aussie, 2 British, 1 Canadian, 2 Americans, a new Zealand couple with their kid). For example, one of them mentioned that they had to learn how to play dodgeball for their P.E. class b/c they'd never played it before, and the American guys had, and some hadn't, etc.

I'd say that's the coolest part of travel: it completely opens you up - not only to other cultures, but to the pros and cons of your own. It's rocks. :]

[Wh|tE gUy]

They finally discovered dodge ball eh? And our secret to military might is finally out...

[MoN]

Originally posted by bountyhunter
Yeh, I like some things, but I must say our education system is messed up. There are a hell of a lot of useless classes that we are required to take, while we only need 2 combined credits of math and science to graduate. If the government had half a brain between all its "members"(for lack of a better term) then it would put more of an emphasis on math and science then it would whatever bull**** they're teaching us in english class(I wouldn't be able to tell you what that would be cause its always some different bull**** that's not interesting enough or important enough to understand). Not sure about you, but in Florida (I believe), to graduate students must have 3 maths OR 3 science credits. Also, English classes are useless? Maybe it's because you're getting low grades or something, I don't know. By the looks of your posts, you are still learning the English language...(I can understand if English isn't your primary language, though.)

[bountyhunter]

Learning the english language has nothing to do with reading Romeo and Juliet, much less knowing that what I just said was some sort of clause or a phrase. BTW, I speak a lot better in real life then I do here, it's just easier to talk in broken/uncorrect english sometimes. but yeh, knowing 2 languages does confuse me sometimes, but english is my primary language, though I don't speak it in the summer when I go to visit my family, which is every summer. But look at that last statement. It was a massive run-on sentence. But does knowing that realy help me in anyway?

[MoN]

Depends on what glasses you take. Knowing how to interpret things is a good skill to have, though.

[Wh|tE gUy]

Originally posted by bountyhunter
Yeh, I like some things, but I must say our education system is messed up. There are a hell of a lot of useless classes that we are required to take, while we only need 2 combined credits of math and science to graduate. If the government had half a brain between all its "members"(for lack of a better term) then it would put more of an emphasis on math and science then it would whatever bull**** they're teaching us in english class(I wouldn't be able to tell you what that would be cause its always some different bull**** that's not interesting enough or important enough to understand).
How is Math needed beyond Geometry and how is Science needed beyond Biology if at all? On the other hand, you will be required to write, read, and comprehend in the future for almost every profession. I really don't see how you find English to be so pointless...

In my district, you are required to have 3 maths, complete Chemistry (Atleast 2 years of Science and there are numerous classes higher than chem), and 4 years of English.

English is all about learning comprehension, tuning your writing skills, and just overall practice

[Monkeylord]

Originally posted by Wh|tE gUy
Here's something that pretty much sums up how people feel about Americans

My teacher was telling us how she and a group of friends were looking for a flat in England to stay for a few months to a year. They find a perfect one, get all the info, and decide to take the offer. They start moving all their stuff in when the building manager comes in and says that they now have to run the agreement by the complex owner. The owner tells them that the monthly rate is actually several hundred dollars more expensive and utilities are no longer included. Why? Because they were American. After the owner left the building manager was shocked and told them that he had never heard of such charges and felt so bad for them he showed them a building across town.

I've also heard stories of the Greeks resenting American Greeks and charging them much more in restraunts and places like that.

It seems like these things happen pretty often, especially in Europe. In contrast, i personally have never heard of a story of American restraunts and hotels taking advantage of tourists.

Can't say I've ever heard of anything like this happening, and I work with a LOT of foreign people - Americans, Australians, Kiwi's, Canadians, West Indian, Jamaican... we tell bizarre stories all the time, but no-ones ever said anything about being ripped off based purely on their home country!

[bountyhunter]

everybody takes advantage of a tourist, but you'd have to show that you are c ompletely ignorant of what's around you in order for them to fully understand that you are a tourist, and not just someone who's from a different country.

[MAX]

Word of advise... if you go backpacking in Europe...pretend you are canadian...

[Wh|tE gUy]

exactly, thats what my teacher said she had to do the rest of her trip in england.

On a similar note, ill be in France for a month this summer and plan to wear nothing but red white and blue the entire time with tons of stars... and a hitler mustache

[MoN]

Originally posted by Messiah
"America is great, Australia is better"- A famous quote i dug up Better for what? You have to specify. For all I know, you could mean amount of rapes Australia has compared to America (http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/cri_rap_cap).

(NOTE: Sorry, I clicked "last post" but apparently I was taken to page 1, not the last page. Shows how much I pay attention!)

[Messiah]

Yeah, here in Australia most people (well most of the people i've talked to) have a premeditated stances on people and where they come from. The good old stereotype rears its head, something thats quite unavoidable. Americans are loud and arrogant and Canadians are nice and pleasant, thats basically what we've been told and how some people see it.

Edit: Why did'nt you single out South Africa instead of Australia, after all its higher. This is turning into a bit of a tit for tat affair :brow:.

[MoN]

I edited my post before you edited yours. So there. :P

[Messiah]

meh, yeah but you PWNED yourself so double there

[Rensa]

Oi, MoN and Messiah, you're getting a little nippy there. ^^

...

Ya know, it's stuff like being voted the most livable city in the world, twice in a row (http://theage.com.au/articles/2004/02/06/1075854028808.html), that makes you proud to live in Melbourne.

Just thought I'd throw that in to keep the bonfire going. ;)

[Wh|tE gUy]

atleast our leader didnt have an aborigian voodoo curse placed on him...

[Rensa]

Hm... must've missed that. :D

Admittedly, Australia's treatment of Koori and other indigenous peoples is absolutely appalling. Most people of indigenous hertitage suffer in terms of education, financial wellbeing, etc. It's pretty awful. :(

[Messiah]

Yeah but they get AB study or what ever it is. They get fortnighly payments from the government. Yeah i feel that they are mistreated though.....and there are heaps of racial jokes. I know a few :P,

And Rensa, i dont know about MoN but i was just have a dig, i was only mucking around back there. No hard feeling's MoN

[MoN]

No, I was merely making a joke. It wasn't aimed at you or anyone. Just funny, right?

[Messiah]

Yep, a joke. I feel so much better getting that out in the open :D

[Rensa]

Cool. :]

So... how about that whether, huh?

[Messiah]

shudup :D

[andre]

my grandparents went to Australia. but anyway.

why does this country's health care system blow compared to others I've heard about?

[bountyhunter]

Because conducting a crusade is a hella' lot more fun then helping a bunch of old people.

[Wh|tE gUy]

Originally posted by andre
my grandparents went to Australia. but anyway.

why does this country's health care system blow compared to others I've heard about?
Because the ones that are so great are all in socialist countries. Basically they pay much higher taxes and make less personal profit in order to support everyone else. It's all in the form of government. Theoretically a communism would have the best of all.

I heard Britain is considering major cut backs on health care and things like that because it's starting to cost too much, is that too much?

[prime_timer]

I say America takes Dave Chappelle's idea, and give everyone in America fake Canadian ID's so we can get free healthcare. That way America wins, and we screw Canada over at the same time! a double whammy!

[Messiah]

The Chappelle shows pretty funny, we dont get it here anymore though:(. A bit offtopic but meh, who cares.

[andre]

I saw that. That was the ****. Yeah. I was thinking about being a doctor, but that would just suck. I should be a lawyer. They seem to get farther in this good old country.

[bountyhunter]

I don't think the words good old and lawyer should ever mix. ever.

I'm going to have the best job of all--terrorist.

[andre]

your first assignment: destroy Microsoft. then the infidels. lol.

[Wh|tE gUy]

Originally posted by bountyhunter
I'm going to have the best job of all--terrorist.
given the intelligence you have shown on these boards, 10$ says your going to be one of the suicide bombers that pushes the button before your even in reach your target, forever remembered as a moron

[prime_timer]

Whenever i think of a suicide terrorist, i think to myself, "It doesnt matter if they did a great thing for their movement, if it gave their clan more money, more power..... They still blew themself up."

[Messiah]

I spose thats true Prime. The ammount of pressure they are under must be unbearable.

[Rensa]

Why do they say, $20 plus sex in heaven? I mea, I wouldn't call it heaven unless there were sex... it's sorta implied.

[MoN]

Originally posted by bountyhunter
I'm going to have the best job of all--terrorist. You could go to jail for that 'statement'...

[andre]

Originally posted by Wh|tE gUy
given the intelligence you have shown on these boards, 10$ says your going to be one of the suicide bombers that pushes the button before your even in reach your target, forever remembered as a moron


heh. funny, yes, but unlikely. who wants to start a wager pool? lol. but no, really. remember what that Cuban guy in James Bond: Die Another Day said about that dude who had the diamonds stuck in his face:

"One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter"

[jamesc359]

Freedom from what? Us? We don't suppress people. Sure we screwed up their world a little. But we certainly didn't oppress Bin Laden nor did we oppress most of the people who hate us.

[Wh|tE gUy]

but in cases like Saudi Arabia we supported their government so we are oppressors by proxy

[MAX]

Originally posted by jamesc359
Freedom from what? Us? We don't suppress people. Sure we screwed up their world a little. But we certainly didn't oppress Bin Laden nor did we oppress most of the people who hate us.

We DO, however, oppress a lot of our own people here in the states... that's just fact.

[jamesc359]

Originally posted by Wh|tE gUy
but in cases like Saudi Arabia we supported their government so we are oppressors by proxyThere is something wrong with supporting a legitimate government? A legitimate government that has the support from the vast majority of its people at that.

rottwylor
We DO, however, oppress a lot of our own people here in the states... that's just fact.How so?

It doesn't really matter what you come up with though. Its completely irrelevant to the outside worlds hatred of us.

[MAX]

If you really need me to give you examples of oppression in our own country... then thats really sad. We oppress people inside and outside our own country, so I think it is pretty damn relevent to how the outside world sees us. I'm not saying that we did or didn't oppress/suppress Osama Bin Laden... I'm just saying that as a COUNTRY, we do it a lot. Minorities, other countries, sanctions, etc...

[enigma7]

Originally posted by bountyhunter
I'm going to have the best job of all--terrorist.

Dude that's really not funny. From other posts I've gathered that you're a Muslim. Any idiot that can put two and two together would be able to see that's a stonefaced serious thing for you to say, especially because of your islamic beliefs. If you've been paying any attention to the news lately you will have noticed that the dept of homeland security busts down peoples doors for saying things just like that in forums and chat rooms. Get a clue.

[MAX]

He'll keep doing it... he thinks he's "cool" for that crap he writes...

[enigma7]

He prob will, but at some point this kid (if he's really 14) is going to have a reality check and see that it's not cool to joke around about using nukes and being a terrorist and describing himself in his bio as looking " like 9/11 highjacker Mouhamed Atah, accept a bit younger ". It's simply not tolerated in this day and age. Maybe it was ok to talk like that before Sept. 11, but we live in a world where terrorist cowards are hunted down and any assumed links to terrorism are investigated by the authorities. If he is just talking crap, he's risking quite a bit for a little fun.

[MAX]

I never saw that he described himself like that....what a moron.

That would be like me saying I look like Timothy McVeigh...but with better skin.... =P

[bountyhunter]

I really do look like that guy, minus the beard. And shove it up your asses. I was just joking. Homeland security can **** themselves up the ***. They're the ones that are the real jokes.

And cut the "he's just stupid" crap, k. I can hate whoever I want and whatever I want, and you can hate me. Just tell me, but don't call me stupid for hating something(if this is directed at you you know what I'm talking about).

[Rensa]

So, we're all enjoying ourselves, right?

[bountyhunter]

yep. I guess

[jamesc359]

Originally posted by rottwylor
If you really need me to give you examples of oppression in our own country... then thats really sad. We oppress people inside and outside our own country, so I think it is pretty damn relevent to how the outside world sees us. I'm not saying that we did or didn't oppress/suppress Osama Bin Laden... I'm just saying that as a COUNTRY, we do it a lot. Minorities, other countries, sanctions, etc...First and formost, I didn't say we didn't oppress people in our country. I said its irrelevant to the worlds hatred of us. I was also asking for an example. Mainly because I want to see what you think is oppression. Anyways, do you really think that any terrorist gives a crap about what we do to our selves?

Also, I would like an example of the so called sanctions that we've used to oppress other countries. Out side of Cuba you're going to be hard pressed to find one that wasn't sanctioned or actually instigated by the U.N.

[Wh|tE gUy]

my arguement, what nation hasn't oppressed. I know it'd be good to think that we would be better than that, but the truth is holding oppresion against us like it's something new is just holding America to a higher standard again and faulting the nation for it. I do like to think that we are one of the least oppressive nations in the world, though

[MAX]

Originally posted by jamesc359
First and formost, I didn't say we didn't oppress people in our country. I said its irrelevant to the worlds hatred of us. I was also asking for an example. Mainly because I want to see what you think is oppression. Anyways, do you really think that any terrorist gives a crap about what we do to our selves?

Americans have always loved their country to such an extent that they feel the need to toss their morals upon other countries. Americans oppress other countries through the cessation of the aforementioned foreign countries beliefs. This type of oppression is what infuriates so many individuals into taking action against the tyrant of beliefs that America has become.

So ignorant is the American republic due to the brainwashing known as nationalism, they do not even notice that anything is wrong, they believe that the only people that are at fault are those who committed the acts of September eleventh. So blindly accepting are they that they believe the attacks were committed without cause, that America as a whole has become the victim of an attack that was not warranted.



Also, I would like an example of the so called sanctions that we've used to oppress other countries. Out side of Cuba you're going to be hard pressed to find one that wasn't sanctioned or actually instigated by the U.N.

I could be wrong... Iraq?

[bountyhunter]

heh. the UN brought the sanction upon Iraq, but who do you think wanted that to happen. Us

[jamesc359]

Um, you keep straying back to our oppression of other countries... My question was to how we oppress our people. Non-the-less, sure to some extent we do impose our moral values onto other countries. But in the vast majority of the cases they are the ones who're wrong and are actually instigating the fight with us.

Iraq for example, started the fight by invading Kuwait. That was a U.N. action by the way. Afghanistan started the fight by supporting a terrorist group that attacked our embassies (Tanzania & Kenya), ships (U.S.S. Cole) and our people (9/11). Just because a few asswipes don't like our presence in other Arab (where we were welcomed by their leaders) countries is no excuse.

BTW: Do you really believe that the killing of innocent people can be warranted because they don't think we should be in other Arab countries (again, who welcomed us)?

I could be wrong... Iraq?Yep, wrong. The only country we have sanctioned that wasn't U.N. approved is Cuba..

[MAX]

Originally posted by jamesc359
Um, you keep straying back to our oppression of other countries... My question was to how we oppress our people.

-Homophobia
-Anti-Semetism
-Racial oppression
-White supremacist
-"If you're not with us, you're against us"
..do I need to list more? The U.S. is notorious for oppressing it's own people. We're too much of a 'melting pot' for it not to happen.

Iraq for example, started the fight by invading Kuwait. That was a U.N. action by the way. Afghanistan started the fight by supporting a terrorist group that attacked our embassies (Tanzania & Kenya), ships (U.S.S. Cole) and our people (9/11). Just because a few asswipes don't like our presence in other Arab (where we were welcomed by their leaders) countries is no excuse.

They didn't want us over there, because we as a country have a tendency to go and 'westernize' other countries. Whether it's intentional or not, we want every other country to cater to us. We want them to come here speaking our language, and we want to go over there and expect them to understand us.


BTW: Do you really believe that the killing of innocent people can be warranted because they don't think we should be in other Arab countries (again, who welcomed us)?

I never inferred that, and would appreciate it if you didn't take me out of context.

Yep, wrong. The only country we have sanctioned that wasn't U.N. approved is Cuba..

Who do you think presses for those sanctions 80 percent of the time.

[Wh|tE gUy]

Originally posted by rottwylor
Who do you think presses for those sanctions 80 percent of the time.
Who do you think ends up doing 80 percent of the UN's work?

[MAX]

Well there ya go! In a round-a-bout way, you backed up my point. I love you like a fat kid loves cake.

[Wh|tE gUy]

Originally posted by rottwylor
Well there ya go! In a round-a-bout way, you backed up my point. I love you like a fat kid loves cake.
So we are agreed, the UN is total bull****. Cherrio :yay:

[jamesc359]

Originally posted by rottwylor
They didn't want us over there, because we as a country have a tendency to go and 'westernize' other countries. Whether it's intentional or not, we want every other country to cater to us. We want them to come here speaking our language, and we want to go over there and expect them to understand us.Big fat hairy deal. Their governments welcomed us. And besides, most terrorists are not even from the countries we have good relationships with. And therefor it is not their decision as to whether or not said country decides to become westernised.
Originally posted by rottwylor
I never inferred that, and would appreciate it if you didn't take me out of context.
Originally posted by rottwylor
So ignorant is the American republic due to the brainwashing known as nationalism, they do not even notice that anything is wrong, they believe that the only people that are at fault are those who committed the acts of September eleventh. So blindly accepting are they that they believe the attacks were committed without cause, that America as a whole has become the victim of an attack that was not warranted.That sure seemed to imply that to me.
Originally posted by rottwylor
Who do you think presses for those sanctions 80 percent of the time. While we may press for them, we certainly don't force anybody to agree. Remember that both Russia and China can veto any thing in the U.N. Not only that, but the majority of the members must agree first as well.
Originally posted by Wh|tE gUy
So we are agreed, the UN is total bull****. Cherrio :yay:Yep.

[Rensa]

Crap, I don't know enough about global politics to participate in this discussion anymore >_<

[MAX]

Originally posted by jamesc359
Big fat hairy deal. Their governments welcomed us. And besides, most terrorists are not even from the countries we have good relationships with. And therefor it is not their decision as to whether or not said country decides to become westernised.

Umm.. you realize that most of the terrorists in 9/11 were from Saudi Arabia, right? I seem to remember us having a good relationship with that country. Also, you asked for me to give you examples. You never said anything about stipulations. I gave an example, it was valid. So stop trying to contradict everything I say. If you wanted examples that DIDN'T include countries where the leaders welcomed us and the people didnt. You should have said that. Even though the leaders welcome us, does NOT mean that the people welcome us OR our ways. Take the recent issues in France, England, Italy, and Spain when our president visited. Tons of people protesting us and the president. So big fat hairy deal to country leaders welcoming us, it's the general population of that country that tells the real feelings towards us.


BTW: Do you really believe that the killing of innocent people can be warranted because they don't think we should be in other Arab countries (again, who welcomed us)?


I don't recall Iraq welcoming us..maybe you have somekind of insider tip?


*edit*
Sidenote- I've always been proud of my country and sometimes our nation does make mistakes - we re not perfect. The bush administration is the biggest mistake we've ever made. For the first time in my life I can say that my government has financially hurt me and my family and our nation as a whole with disregard. In addition there is an unnecessary personal vendetta war and thousands of people are dying and it has nothing to do with terror. I hope that our great nation can recover after this travesty is voted out in november.

Also, it's good to see GW taking Democrat advice and expanding to include U.N. and NATO (Kerry's plan originally). Good for him.

[jamesc359]

I grow tired of this.... So I'm quiting.
I have to agree with you regarding Mr. Bush. He and his entire cabinet is nothing more than a glorified joke. Well, except for Powell. He should have ran for President.

[Rensa]

So, uh... what do you guys actually think of America, as a whole? You've used up five pages with political debate, but I don't think you've actually said what you like/dislike about the US. Hmm... ^^

[MAX]

I did earlier...in the begining. =)

I like powell too, I also agree he should (have/still) run for pres.

[Wh|tE gUy]

he has already stated that he never will run for president because he thinks politics are too ugly and he doesn't want people probing into every mistake he ever made.

Personally i think this is selfish of him to an extent. With the current list of democrats that will be running for pres for years to come, he DEFINITELY has a chance of winning it all and becoming the first black president. Does this logic seem strange too anyone?

[boon]

all i know is that i hate america because the school system and our society allows morons like bountyhunter to flourish here and create idiots just like the ones in office but with different views.

[jamesc359]

Does this logic seem strange too anyone?Not really. Personally I don't give a crap what party he is with though. I usually tend to judge a politician by his actions. Not his party. Party bull**** is what got us Bush.

Eh, anyways. My opinion of the U.S. is very biased because I live here. But I'll give my opinion non-the-less.

I wouldn't want to live anywhere else. We have one of the best legal systems in the world. I know there are holes in it and always will be, but its still a lot better than anywhere else I can think of.

We do have a lot of political BS. I live in a state thats mostly (2/3 I believe) Republican. A huge mistake in my opinion. I believe that any government should be well balanced. Like it or not, both sides have their dark side and need each other to counteract their respective dark sides.

I do feel that on the worlds stage we're held to a higher standard than everybody else. Sometimes its deserved. But most of the time its not. Nobody really remembers the good things we do for the world. But every little mistake is held against us to no end. And even more unfortunately is the fact that the world holds 90% of the U.N.s major actions against us.

If you've read some of my other posts in this thread, it should be clear that I really don't like the U.N. because we're their lackey. < Thats off topic though.

Eh, thats my opinion.

[Wh|tE gUy]

You put it perfectly. Yeah, that is one of the problems with the electoral college, it adds an even more worthless feeling to your vote of one when you know what your state will always vote for. I am a self proclaimed democrat, but i still don't like the fact that if I were ever to vote republican (which I may in November) it will be beyond useless, atleast as long as i reside in California.

[Professor Go]

Just sick of the Republicans and everything they stand for, otherwise America rocks.

Oh yeah also fundamentalist Christians. That's all.

[McBizzel]

HOLY CRAP!!!! Profess! Where the Hell have you been man? --~

[MAX]

Down with Fundies!!!